That’s really nice to hear. Probably the immersive version with the improvements to its stereo algorithms will be helpful in your music production.
Eventide Blackhole Immersive
- KVRist
- 159 posts since 31 Aug, 2020
Monitors: HS7 / Mixing: Cubase Pro 13 / Mastering: WaveLab Pro 11.2 / Sound Design: Live 12 Suite
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ChamomileShark ChamomileShark https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=25116
- KVRAF
- 2862 posts since 12 May, 2004 from Oxford, UK
I've got both.
I think it says in the blurb that the Micropitch has also been rebuilt. I compared the "H3000 Micropitch" presets on one sound and they sound different. The Immersive one sounded clearer with both the EQ on and off. Of course they may have tweaked the actual preset between the two different versions.
I think it says in the blurb that the Micropitch has also been rebuilt. I compared the "H3000 Micropitch" presets on one sound and they sound different. The Immersive one sounded clearer with both the EQ on and off. Of course they may have tweaked the actual preset between the two different versions.
Pastoral, Kosmiche, Ambient Music https://markgriffiths.bandcamp.com/
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Experimental Music https://markdaltongriffiths.bandcamp.com/
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- KVRAF
- 1511 posts since 10 Jul, 2018
Someone on VI Control claims Eventide told them that the algorithm is the same.
But original Blackhole sums to mono before applying the reverb. And Immersive has more EQ options.
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- KVRer
- 15 posts since 18 Jan, 2021
Ok. I did some testing on this thing in stereo, I pitted it against Blackhole and Valhalla Supermassive.
First I had to turn the crossfeed knob all the way down to zero, cause with crossfeed on, it's already a whole new reverb plugin, that alone may or may not be justification for upgrading from your regular BH.
But now with crossfeed off, the sound of BH Immersive still has more depth and width than Blackhole, though retains the same character. So clearly, crossfeed isn't the only thing going on here.
With this impression that BHI is wider, I fired up a correlation meter. Conclusion is clear. Regular Blackhole stays in the green to yellow area, going further red only with loud lower frequencies inputs. On the other hand, BH Immersive has the correlation meter dancing back and forth from green to red very quickly, at any frequency input. Clearly, even in stereo BH Immersive has a wider soundfield than Blackhole. This has a big impact on the perception of quality in the sound. Now I am not saying this is the only thing going on here, but it is definitly going on.
To verify this further, I loaded up Valhalla Supermassive, not for reverb tail comparison, but because Supermassive has a width knob on the bottom left. Well, from my ears and from looking at the correlation meter, BH sound is similar in width to Supermassive's sound with width knob set to 80, or -80. BH Immersive's sound is similar to Supermassive with width set to 100 (or -100).
First I had to turn the crossfeed knob all the way down to zero, cause with crossfeed on, it's already a whole new reverb plugin, that alone may or may not be justification for upgrading from your regular BH.
But now with crossfeed off, the sound of BH Immersive still has more depth and width than Blackhole, though retains the same character. So clearly, crossfeed isn't the only thing going on here.
With this impression that BHI is wider, I fired up a correlation meter. Conclusion is clear. Regular Blackhole stays in the green to yellow area, going further red only with loud lower frequencies inputs. On the other hand, BH Immersive has the correlation meter dancing back and forth from green to red very quickly, at any frequency input. Clearly, even in stereo BH Immersive has a wider soundfield than Blackhole. This has a big impact on the perception of quality in the sound. Now I am not saying this is the only thing going on here, but it is definitly going on.
To verify this further, I loaded up Valhalla Supermassive, not for reverb tail comparison, but because Supermassive has a width knob on the bottom left. Well, from my ears and from looking at the correlation meter, BH sound is similar in width to Supermassive's sound with width knob set to 80, or -80. BH Immersive's sound is similar to Supermassive with width set to 100 (or -100).
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- KVRer
- 15 posts since 18 Jan, 2021
And yes Blackhole in freeze mode goes to mono full right green in correlation meter, (which is a shame really) while BH Immersive dances across the whole green-red spectrum in freeze mode.
To be honest I don't like the sound of freeze mode in BH Immersive even if it's stereo. Too harsh, too artificial.
To be honest I don't like the sound of freeze mode in BH Immersive even if it's stereo. Too harsh, too artificial.
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- KVRist
- 202 posts since 4 Dec, 2003 from Oregon, USA
I got immersive yesterday, but it's crashing Bitwig 2.5 beta in Win 11. Sad. It sounded great for a second though!
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- KVRist
- 190 posts since 14 Nov, 2020
Fellow Bitwig 5.2 Beta in Win 11 user here and Immersive is running just fine. Maybe try reinstalling it?idoru97214 wrote: ↑Thu May 23, 2024 2:19 pm I got immersive yesterday, but it's crashing Bitwig 2.5 beta in Win 11. Sad. It sounded great for a second though!
- KVRAF
- 2939 posts since 9 Dec, 2011 from falling
Bitwig 5.2 beta 2 and Blackhole Immersive working with no crashes on Mac.
Bitwig Certified Trainer
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vitocorleone123 vitocorleone123 https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=333504
- KVRAF
- 1964 posts since 30 Jun, 2014 from Pacific NW
Supermassive may have mono summing happening at some point, because it doesn't originate echoes from left or right like Blackhole Immersive and some other "true stereo" reverbs I have. Of course, sometimes you don't want a wide reverb....Chauzou wrote: ↑Thu May 23, 2024 2:03 pm Ok. I did some testing on this thing in stereo, I pitted it against Blackhole and Valhalla Supermassive.
First I had to turn the crossfeed knob all the way down to zero, cause with crossfeed on, it's already a whole new reverb plugin, that alone may or may not be justification for upgrading from your regular BH.
But now with crossfeed off, the sound of BH Immersive still has more depth and width than Blackhole, though retains the same character. So clearly, crossfeed isn't the only thing going on here.
With this impression that BHI is wider, I fired up a correlation meter. Conclusion is clear. Regular Blackhole stays in the green to yellow area, going further red only with loud lower frequencies inputs. On the other hand, BH Immersive has the correlation meter dancing back and forth from green to red very quickly, at any frequency input. Clearly, even in stereo BH Immersive has a wider soundfield than Blackhole. This has a big impact on the perception of quality in the sound. Now I am not saying this is the only thing going on here, but it is definitly going on.
To verify this further, I loaded up Valhalla Supermassive, not for reverb tail comparison, but because Supermassive has a width knob on the bottom left. Well, from my ears and from looking at the correlation meter, BH sound is similar in width to Supermassive's sound with width knob set to 80, or -80. BH Immersive's sound is similar to Supermassive with width set to 100 (or -100).
- KVRAF
- 10456 posts since 3 Feb, 2003 from Finland, Espoo
I'm really tempted to crossgrade to the immersive version of Blackhole. Anybody know a good youtube video with tons of sound examples comparing the old vs the new? Though I guess I could always demo it myself.. hmm..
"Wisdom is wisdom, regardless of the idiot who said it." -an idiot
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- KVRer
- 12 posts since 2 Jan, 2022 from Germany
Unfortunately I know of no good YouTube videos or comparisons with the stereo version.
Does anyone know if the current crossgrade prices are time-limited offers or will it stay at this price?
Does anyone know if the current crossgrade prices are time-limited offers or will it stay at this price?
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- KVRist
- 158 posts since 18 Mar, 2004
You really should. It's noticeably improved, even if you never never touch the EQ and only use stereo.
Here's a couple quotes from the Eventide developer on the GS thread.
One audible distinction is in how Freeze works. In the H9 plugin, the image collapses to mono; in the Immersive version, you can control if the frozen stereo image stays independently spatialized or mixes and changes over time... and you can do this dynamically in real time. This is part of what I mean when I say that the Immersive line is totally and fundamentally rethought from the ground-up in terms of how sound operates in three spatial dimensions; this is at odds with how the H9 Blackhole fundamentally approaches reverb. Another sonic distinction is that in Immersive you can dynamically change the Gravity knob and see no appreciable change in energy whereas in the H9 plugin there is slight growth or attenuation in the reverb energy when you change Gravity rapidly. The modulation section has been overhauled in Immersive as well - there is smoother and more accurate modulation, which changes the character of the modal and echo densities of the reverb.
I thought about this over the weekend, and there is another important distinction between Blackhole Immersive in stereo and the H9 Blackhole plug-in. Because of the changes we made to the algorithmic structure, we were able to break out Pre Delay and Loop Delay into two separate controls on Blackhole Immersive. In the H9 plug-in, there is a singular Predelay knob which controls all delay (related to - but not the same as - Pre Delay and Loop Delay from Immersive) in the structure.
This is a subtler quirk of the Immersive algorithm, but having independent Pre Delay and Loop Delay controls opens up a large swathe of sounds. Moving the Loop Delay to higher values than Predelay allows control over time in echo density growth. This allows for a different reverb characteristic that blooms and fades in a manner that nudges sound closer to what happens in an actual room (although I wouldn't necessarily call it realistic). It can also help to break up or induce more resonant and combing structures by respectively increasing or decreasing Loop Delay. In this way, Pre Delay can be used as a more traditional production control to delay the onset of when the reverb tail starts to hit. It's a very flexible layer of control, especially at smaller Size values.
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- KVRist
- 202 posts since 4 Dec, 2003 from Oregon, USA
That's good to hear. I managed to get it working as a patch in BC patchwork. I'll try to reinstall as well. It really does sound great. Worth the $50 to me easy.tactile_coast wrote: ↑Thu May 23, 2024 4:04 pmFellow Bitwig 5.2 Beta in Win 11 user here and Immersive is running just fine. Maybe try reinstalling it?idoru97214 wrote: ↑Thu May 23, 2024 2:19 pm I got immersive yesterday, but it's crashing Bitwig 2.5 beta in Win 11. Sad. It sounded great for a second though!